JS Perf Wins & New Node.js Features with Yagiz Nizipli

Wes try to enumerate them, and we have a dedicated benchmark CI in the Node. Js infrastructures

There's everybody listening to this is a web developer. They're writing JavaScript every day. Like, there's probably very few people listening that write C plus plus

and some of the APIs are written in JavaScript. And part of what you do is say, okay, this API is slow because it's been implemented via

provides they are not pluggable. I can't add a new rule without contributing to BiOMORE or OXT.

for Windows machines or x t x 60 4 machines.

In their day to day.

those types of performance

And which, you are contributing it on your own time.

for different architectures. So let's talk about, like,

and

wise, contributor wrote on Twitter saying that running on the view repository one of the lead engineers of view Bos that we always have to pay. Mhmm. Wes. But it is it it's not. So So you mentioned that Neon, which is Wes How many times The downside is that, because I contributed and read a lot of those Node. Js functions, Node. Js internals.

I like, to 100 different engineers, they would like, 90 or 80% of them will say that we could

And most of the performance wise required Tasks are written in, Sanity of the JSON file. Mhmm. So I think Biome and other, Implementers, they support these kinds of things, and they even support, And it's, like, extremely the Node Bos and try to Find those kinds of bottlenecks, and even small things can have really huge impacts.

Vercel I could probably do it in a single reduce, but it's gonna be much more complex. And I'll often opt for the

And do you have to run those benchmarks on different hardware as well? I remember, like, By 10 years ago, Node one of the node team members was running a bunch of raspberry pies as well as I wanna talk a lot Scott,

Not

the web of what makes it faster. So If you ask this to,

what is the most fundamental thing that runs on every part of the Node Bos?

as others.

I'll often have an array and I need to distill it down. So I'll run a filter on it, and then I'll I'll need to map over it and add some data, and then I might I might chain a couple of maps and a couple of filters together because

So an example I have is Cool. Alright. Last thing is a shameless Plug, what would you like to plug to the audience? I don't Node. My Twitter account, if you care about any performance,

query string parser or or those kinds of things that we always have to run, and I try to optimize that. And, yeah, that's what I did. And that's typically done in in c plus plus. Right? So for anyone It's important to find the edge cases that you pass.

He helped and optimized for me, it's extremely beneficial

issues or performance areas that you could

But that requires to have Yeah. So the issue is that even though Sanity.

improving the Encourage people to use package JSON as a key value storage

parse. Node that cost is is, is Parse like more,

caring

How do you how do you go about finding

and mostly, we don't write hardware specific code in No, Jess, which means that we don't write specific if your computer allows it, you can go, having a key and package Pnpm.

But it it result return resulted in writing 3 or 4 different implementations.

I'm just curious about

I'm much I'm more interested in, a good baseline for, tap in and mutate the contents of the file. So if that's if that file is a TypeScript, Oh, that's Yep. That's awesome. This this is why

Do you have any sort of guidelines as to, like, when you should start caring these about these things? So

at what point you should start

That might be,

who doesn't know? Node. JS is not written in JavaScript. It's it's written primarily in c plus plus,

different, And it's maybe 3 times faster than BIO. But doesn't have any formatting right now, but the ESLint is extremely fast. So,

but also making it fast.

and whenever you call a c plus plus function from

that was one of the the things they targeted at the time Wes, how fast does it run on a Raspberry Pi? Yeah. So it's much easier for me to reason about it, Debug it to read the actual code running instance. Is that right? So,

so what what are you what are you using to measure those changes to know if you're having an impact or not? So we have the Bos So

Multiple map filter reduces, and people will say, hey. Like, that's what about performance? And my answer to that is I'm looping over 3 spans on a page. I don't think it matters.

I will just run a profiler, and I will just look into the flame graph and see what Yarn that takes the most time, and I will just Try to optimize that.

So, yeah, I basically select, not a numeric value, but I know the overhead of calling a function. And, this is why even though I really like Wes. In projects, and they they really revolutionized

that we run these kinds of things. And because that machine is extremely old, it it reflects the worst case scenario of the optimization

or Yarn no. It wasn't Arduino. A bunch of raspberry pies in their office as part of the The test suite because I I remember years ago, there was a, I think, a blog post from Sanity, who is the creator and,

and that c plus plus function was returning an object. And if if that object had an error,

ADA, URL parser, we have made those optimizations. That's why ADA is extremely fast.

Mom,

So not always moving them to node, to c plus plus site is always a Good site. Most of the time, most optimizations and nudges company owned and it's community owned,

Even begin to start figuring out, you know, untangling the,

nonperformance or any sort of issue with, But, yeah, bat m is one of those features that I've developed and got really positive feedback.

On top of that, Has it. A lot of Volta has it. A lot of different packages has it. And if you make this package JSON file really big, then it becomes you never get any positive feedback about, that username is the username and password is the password. So it checks for the at characters, but it couldn't find it. So it goes back to the column, and then it says It sees that there's a 2 slash character.

Daniel's expertise comes in. And because he's a professor and working and have all of these different machines.

started working on Converting it to string and then passing string to somewhere else and then coding JSON ADA, we bundle Npm, Node. Js is almost,

Right?

and there's there isn't any company behind it that could give us those kinds of benchmark

URL, or file system operations or When, Let's say we we talk about Sanity, when you should when,

inputs does it take,

from 40 different collaborators of the performance gains And if you optimize for speed, this means that you will have a really high, And, The environment is a lot better because we are, we basically Like, like, in in terms of impact, it's impactful yeah, there's like

a library that's been implemented in JavaScript and just rewrite it to To be native, meaning it runs in c plus plus? Yeah. So the the thing is,

Node libraries in JavaScript. So you can then take

syntax space FM, and that needs to be translated into something that, Because you have you basically have access to a lot of really smart and intelligent people that wants to improve the call that you've written because you share a common, functions, but they include, All of the configurations in all of these projects, they to finish it.

Scott machine. And in order to make,

tests.

it's an extremely complex and, like, what is the big o notation of this four loop that I'm iterating?

username, colon, password at local host, because it was a trivial task, I also assume that it was a really easy task as, So that's the impact of,

it has The URL has around maybe 3,000 or 2,000 CSS modules into JavaScript is via a loader. Is that right? I I don't know. I I don't know. I Maybe it's pnpm not what you're doing. Yeah. Yeah. But I I thought that was coming. If if it's a CSS file or if it's something else, like, you can basically do anything. You can just load a macOS application. You can you can load Rust code in Node. Wes. If you, P a c q u e t, which which is under PMPM organization right now.

iterate through the whole whole string.

which influence other libraries as well, including Bos. For example, boost ported

or it's the original state manager. Right? You can put so much in it, and I I probably every developer in their life has just said,

This means that if you have a space character in That's also solved as well.

we

7,000,000 edge cases down. Is there is there, like, a test suite for all the different Possible URLs, and and do you know how many tests are in there? Yeah. So

split it on the equals

those kind of things might get overlooked.

I'm just gonna split it on the question mark

for example, But the performance, if you look into the benchmarks, it's Any, from JavaScript Should you optimize for the error path? No. You should optimize for the happy path because that's the. And then we have this hot path, which is and then I benchmark import or require a module, Up until to the point that you care about performance, you don't know that it's slow. And if you if you if you look into that and realize that it's slow, then

This is because a lot of people Mhmm. So if you have an file system if you have a config file, so yeah.

Chrome, Firefox developers, they come together, and they release this URL specification.

It's The URL is the original state machine, Oh, yeah. So

It's translated into percentage Wes.

and then,

Or yeah.

which is Web application bubble. So it's like Safari, And because it runs on democracy and, like, people can reject and

more tests on top of that

space is extremely huge, and That's something that's, If it's a string, If it's an, a really complex, data structures, they we always pay for this cost. It's like calling

up to date technologies and methodologies in order to speed things up. That's why we have this

When when it sees a column at h t p s h t p s column, It says that, okay, the protocol state has ended. So right now, I can have a authority state, a path state, a file path state, Or so on and so forth. So in that scenario, it checks for an at character because if you have those kinds of benefits up up until the certain point is also beneficial for it. And with

So Just all kinds of I I don't think people realize how complicated URLs can be.

storage

And they just want to get UTF 8. So if you So invalid states, valid states, and whatever Those kinds of projects, They need more than 1, even though a lot of people use Node. Js, you will Vercel Node. Js license

Oh, here's a question.

Sentry because

Yeah. I would go for speed at the end time. And this is what we did with, Node, open source libraries, and, semantic versioning,

Like, I'm not getting paid to contribute Node. Js,

packages.

Because it's not, from that.

And because I'm I was under the o one visa, which is an extraordinary ESLint pizza pnpm for US.

Yeah. The the benefits of TypeScript is, like, there's no discussion there.

it's being used by And I was like, this is this is ridiculous. Right? And, like, it might Scott. That's a A really good example of, like, your mindset of performance first because whoever wrote that code that caused that 80 millisecond

The amount of money people are spending to run run this compute. Yeah. And just recently, I realized that, like, because electron use is Wes.

explanation for happy path JS that Warp URL parsing or fast operations by 5%, you directly

Bun has TypeScript support. Is that something that you think Node will ever adopt? So,

Like, what's more important? And how do you decide what's more important JS

like, Wes. I'm warp CGS.

and I think this is what is going for Node. Js And the most, Mhmm. They have this expectancy towards it, and that makes it a really, implementation.

I I feel I get the vibe that working on Node can be kind of, like, thankless at some Sometimes. Do do you get that, or or what's it what's it like? So it's,

you know, like, when you go have a piece of hardware and they have, like, a licenses section,

so any changes can come in any version, and that's kind of really, what's what you're doing. And because it's a free software, people use it and because they're using it On their most crucial, query,

have been committing to Node for what you said.

And, For example, if you call the read file sync,

keypad. Yep. And another one I hear, and maybe you can explain what that this is into performance world, is the hot path. Yeah. Hot yeah. Hot path is

Yeah. I'm getting back full.

bundle size because

without rendering TypeScript, key

they put a license. But the weird thing is

let's say, go to Webpack just if you want to optimize f Wes.

that particular path is called a lot of times, that's what we call a hot path as well. Okay. So types as a command so that you don't need to build, if you execute a node index JS command, it will Check for a package, Jason,

Yeah. That's that's Really the, like, the reality of the situation.

with I think there's a new proposal Sanity c 39 for making TypeScript, Like, for example, just recently, If you import any modules in e s m, it initializes more than I can count.

Npm package license, but nothing to Node jets, which is Scott of beard. But before answering what what I think is best is that most of the non crucial APIs, Speed it up. So these these kind of things are what, I was the performance strategic, Yeah. So, 300 ESLint, they're extremely impactful for performance. And Holy smokes. That 5,000 cuts is the correct, and it has different goals.

but in terms of the,

and transpile your code, rot. Not rot is the correct word, but, like, to,

that comes with SWC,

Around 3, 4 months ago, I was applying for green card.

deployment.

it impacts JavaScript, there's this cost that you always have to pay, which is the serialization of the data that you Yarn passing.

keeps Node. Js going.

Yeah. Yeah.

we are releasing less carbon dioxide because of the usages of the computers. And

because it's Extremely easy So I didn't see any specific ESLint from my side, but What I could say is that because Node is an open source project, and it's maintained by,

Often I'll go through the licenses of the Instagram app or the infotainment a good chunk of the world. So the funny thing is,

whatever that package name is, and you can run any TypeScript module right now.

Extremely funny. And we were talking with Matthew in Node month ago, and I was like, hey, man. Like, your name is on Oracle. Then he was like, Yeah. So what? He was so he he was so used to it that I was like, oh my god. This is really, really. Yeah.

maintainer of curl.

If Compile Rust dynamically a And because we don't have Chromium and we have v eight, lose that particular point because of how these super optimized And

because it's like, if if you make, like, a probability analysis, you will see that 95% of the times if you call or or read file sync in any application,

to, I I I should have used this example,

We are extremely close to supporting TypeScript on Google Chrome, they go into the toolbar and instead of Rewriting a you're out there writing The principles.

the impact because, like, it's it's it's literally used everywhere. So that's that's really good. Yeah. It's it's crazy the scale because you don't get hacked, you don't look into that particular approach to our Node, and then you don't realize that you're already hacked.

How how long was it not that long? Right? 2 years? Yeah? Yeah. Oh, almost 2 years, I guess. Almost 2 Yarn? What what's it like working on a a project of that

or or Flexbox or Grid or Using a library to fetch data, be like, I wrote that code, and now people who run podcast

has TypeScript support,

But if you go for storage, then your application becomes significantly slower,

path. Yeah. I always think how funny that is with,

and be like, hey. Do you see how that Text is aligned there. I worked on that, and every single person in the world that is holding an iPhone and seeing left aligned text or That's cool. Because that's Scott just wrote a really cool Loader for our own website. You want you wanna talk about that, Scott?

would cost them an extra dollar in bandwidth in order to send it out from their data centers, and it's it's wild that, like,

several, and I even, SSD. You can always buy, So, A performance bottleneck because then you need to parse a huge JSON file and trying to find the values that you care most, which is name, type, there's, like, maybe 500 different rules or whatever. I don't know. The impact is huge. And that the operating system offers.

The UTFA. So yeah.

because of, configs, But in Rust, I don't know if that's possible. They did. They did. Rome Did they? Did it. Yeah. Rome did it and That's true. Like, what's your involvement with Node. Js? Right now, I I'm a Node. Js technical steering committee member.

you add all of these large binaries in order to optimize for those each path.

And you can just pass Node minus minus loader equals those kind of features.

we, JSON stringify

on the Sanity code Bos to replace webpack with RS pack. I've been seeing RS pack pop up a whole bunch. Is that something that you think is ready for prime time use as a a drop in? To summarize for those who doesn't know, I replaced, The, Sentri's webpack build with RS pack Nature.

And just the amount of emails he gets from random people who don't understand

Support

CSS or whatever to run those benchmarks.

in those, Put my hat to the pillow? I'm extremely satisfied because I did what I did what I could do for the better of the world, speed. I don't go for storage because you can always buy more, pass any node options that's the reality.

immediately what I thought. Like, making

applications crucified is the correct word, I guess, parsing the JavaScript. So this is what I did with PMPM.

is, my name is included in the Oracle's, So I initially started contributing to Node because I rewrote the URL parser, people think. So loaders are what we call like, whenever you, like,

no amount of money can, pay or,

Like, 32 gig,

I think because we basically check for JavaScript that we we check for a JSON Mhmm. File, and that JSON file is technically package JSON is also a JSON file, but, a a hash character, which is a starting point of fragment. It differentiates and goes through all of those layers. And each of those States has different encoding and decoding parameters.

like, even my own parents or my friends doesn't realize the impact of the thing of the things that I do, but Yeah.

like, In particular for, I wouldn't use it for any company with the size of Sentry, but I would use it for my own personal projects. And

really smart people.

So I basically pnpm, 2, 3 months googling every day trying to find my name on one of those licenses so I can show it To the relievers of the US government. And in those This means that right now, we are in the host name state. So it goes to the host name state until it sees a a column, Which which is the starting point of port But, which improved the read passing by 40, 50% or something. So this is what Wes we commonly do as well.

From people all all around the globe, and most of the time, you even get,

produce if you add a specific

on Node. Js, which is if you just Node to it it has some weird Bos.

200,000,000 users or however many users they had Would would cost so much. So you think about that in in perf, you know, like, if a CPU is literally running 20% less Because you've improved this common use case. Like,

blown up by

That's good. I I've recently saw that you made a

You basically look into what users do or, mattresses that you need to traverse some, Because TypeScript doesn't follow, The changes that I did or any contribution 5 months ago, I started rewriting PMPM with Rust, We didn't include it in yet JS that because type even TypeScript team doesn't want us to, And

they had to design, like, an email template and whatever, and

Change a lot a lot about your

Like, scary situation for Node. Js collaborators and maintainers.

PR

as a trade off for

then you have a performance win. This is what I did, And I basically try to find what is the most optimum way optimum way of, So whenever you find the correct one, we parse that package JSON and before resolving that particular file, It basically contains, It will not throw an error because the developer already checks if it exists or not. But on the 20%, it will throw an error. So in that case, You ask yourself

To one day be able to, like, go to a friend or or people who work on browsers

to migrate from Webpack to. It's also a really good choice

What are your personal thoughts on it? I know, you know, we have Deno,

install,

And even, because of the bottleneck.

because of what's

that's major both in terms of, like, how much energy it's using JS well as

Millions and millions of emails to I can say it was it was to BlackBerry. And every time BlackBerry had to email every single one of their users,

found out that Oracle is using Fastify. And because Fastify uses 1st query So, Depending on the usage, depending on the API that we warp calling, and depending on the impact of that function, I go for, feature might help us. So you can basically

just, like, point out what how many times each FS functions get called and what with what arguments.

faster code base? And I know the answer is probably it depends, but I'd be curious to see if you have any thoughts on that. If it's a front end application, the, yeah, bundle size is a lot more So we'll we'll throw you on there as well. Thank you so much for coming on. Appreciate all your time. This was awesome, and, we'll catch you later. Thank you. Thank you. Peace.

machines with 10, 15 core CPUs.

maybe 6 months ago in read file sync, So every time you call a new URL, it actually runs 20,000 lines of c plus plus code.

to answer your question, I don't think it's It's ready to be used by a project with the size of, When you when you learn those kinds of things, you can't turn them off.

Like, really hard job to do it because coding, blah blah, it will make 7, 8 8 different, But, like, this this is the this is the reality. Like, Everybody uses, library. I I I'm try so they are currently using SIM JSON with package JSON resolver.

I think with that Vercel, big machines underrated Even improving It can be mutated or updated or changed I was applying for green card for extraordinary talent. And one of the requirements is that your licensed software needs to be used by a really well known company.

in Node.

Such a small thing, including 1 extra character

And I would just love It's it's possible. So you could write a loader that requires a compiler that Pnpm installed Yeah. Uh-huh. So if if you're writing, like, a a loop in JavaScript

of my

because you don't need to and it's all written in Rust, so it's extremely fast.

A change can have on on things like that. I remember years ago, I had a friend. He worked for a company that sent out emotional one. Yeah. I think learning how to read a flame graph JS a very good skill

they, like, distilled it down to every single character how fast something runs or how big the bundle is? Is it worth adding more code, therefore inflating the bundle size

Desktop. And I'll be like, there's people's names in this piece of hardware that we've had on the podcast.

it's any sort of Issues issue with minimizers it's called Pacquette, Wow. ADA ADA URL parser Node without rendering TypeScript, Have a direct access to the machine itself, and that's where,

and, obviously, BUN is very performance minded, and they always push these graphs that are a 1000 times faster than than Node. Js, and we we asked him, like, like, how is it possible that you you can make it so much faster? And

common use case. Oh, if it's an array of one thing, we don't need to do this work. Is that A common thing to do in performance is to

in the code base. So, like, instantiation

just up front check for these per perf wins. Yeah. So so that's That's what we call an happy path, which means that, like, what's the most Oh. The positive path towards a function execution that goes.

for

As I understand it, there will be simply like an if statement

you can you could just use SIMD instructions, which is single instruction, multiple data, which means that hard disk and more storage, but

And

you often have different npm TypeScript,

I think he just did,

a port value,

SIM JSON is written by, again, Daniel Lemery, the professor that Pnpm worked with on either URL parser. So,

How much a even a small dive into that world was able to unlock

data, so that's that's fine, I guess. But yeah. Thank you. Yeah. Yeah. It's good to hear that

parse and maybe

Head on over to syntax.fm

Yagit's Twitter

faulty JSON, which,

what was it? The JSON lib that you included, what was that called again?

specifically in our Svelte project, is sometimes I hit a hit save Twice in order for the linter to catch up. It'll show me an old

performance issues are considered as a bug in this project. This this is what he said, and it's like In the past so I started contributing Node a year and a half ago, maybe around 2 years ago.

Yeah. I I love seeing all I don't I don't BS. That's that's why. I don't BS. I only

where you have all of these flags. So with a config file, I could set like, alright, I want debug,

quantifiable And in that portion, if it's corresponds to 10%, but you spend 90% of the time on v eight or any other function, you realize that But if if we move that error state to c plus plus site,

JSON file. Oh, and That show everything.

frame rate bottlenecks and all sorts of things. And the okay. Now I have to get into

Application because it's, So the thing is,

And don't forget to subscribe in your podcast player or drop a review if you like this show.

Like, you need to be able to let the community author this stuff in JavaScript.

fast if you write the code really good. Mhmm. But if you write multithread, then the question becomes, how can I Right? A really performance multi threaded application, and then the real engineering

Those kinds of things. Yeah. We've been hearing just this week, everybody's talking about biome, and now I'm hearing about this.

But there are many parts of ESLint

And if case and say that if encoding is equal to UTF 8 and You call a specific function super optimized for UTF 8, to Node. Js that if if there's a Bos compiler that Has like, if if it if the Rust compiled it in NPM, I am I iterating If you run a fetch, it creates 5 more types.

We

replicate some of the ESLint

Yeah. The Boschian was a contributor to BIOME in the past Enroll. Okay.

It's it's really easy to All of our ADA tests today are Node Bos, and they found 6 different bugs in their code by just porting our Wes. So Wow. It's extremely, literally do anything because of all of those changes that's happening to the SM launch right now. Yeah. I when loaders came out, this was probably 3 years ago, but that's is going to have huge impacts on the company. So Care about, but,

maybe

I don't want to affect any existing applications in terms of performance.

But we don't, which had much more impact than dot m file, but because it wasn't open and And it was not the the scene it's we had maybe 30, 40 different PRs, and both personal and both worldwide, but It's the most

rather than trying to make it any useful out of this, but, yeah, interesting.

Lots of configurations in here. We tend to do it. ESLint has support for,

I'd like to like But eventually ancestors, the the most common values for that and try to optimize for that. And then you will have a significant boost in that

Let me tell you, Wes, I heard about it this morning

Follow there. You're a great follow on Twitter, by the way.

it's extremely easy. And because I recently added SIM JSON, which is a Superfast library written by Daniel Lemirek.

like, linters,

This is mostly done because that tech adjacent contains either type module or TypeScript Wes. So you know how where to How to load a ASM module? no, So, yeah, there it yeah. Node of the instead of the happy path.

And if you have those specific key value pairs, then you can use it as a config file as well. But that's not the intention vendor TypeScript The s I m d, JSON.

A a retweet about this, and I was like, I've never heard of this. Yeah.

There's probably other people that have to download gigs and gigs of JSON as well. Yep. So Simmed Jason. Yeah.

which is a extremely bad case. But On c plus plus, on those kind of things,

Thank you so much for all of that stuff on on pnpm in general. I I mean, I think a lot of it is, like, pretty eye opening to the challenges that, You know, the the Node team or any developer's face here. I think now where we wanna go with the show is taking in the part of sick picks and shameless plugs,

Studios or podcast apps, they have to download gigs and gigs and gigs of XML.

Wes because I've always wanted to be able to use trailing commas and put comments in my Comment. JSON in Node. JS, but I've I've brought I've made issues many times specifically in the Npm repo, and they've they've closed it saying it's it would cause too much breakage to the community.

if if you are comparing single thread to different like, single thread ROS and single thread Node. Js, by 16 bit 16 by 16 and iterated in the less amount of time on a single track.

I'd like to write some blogs, make that, performant,

a lot more performance Is it

compiler

Before going into multi threading, but the bundle size is extremely Node. Because you're using the most native, APIs, Whether you should call a ASM module or a common JS module. So even though if you have the latest computers, like enables those kinds of improvements.

When I went to do it single threaded in Rust,

it's a good follow. Wes, and also for everyone listening, we have a Twitter list of All of our guests.

unfortunately, because companies doesn't want to bad money. They don't want to sponsor or whatever their internal agent is.

doomed to,

so yeah. Six gigabytes a second to minify a JSON

No. Jess? 200 rules on 590.

app. And I was doing frame by frame of raw video,

run nodes with Node config file JS equal to package JSON.

so it can be used, but if, we don't have that much, improvements.

if you have

that tells something about the character of a project and that I really like and respect.

for a full archive of all of our shows,

for us, I I think the, posting, With with GSTalk and IntelliSense, At the end, I can I can Wes whenever I put my, a c plus plus function September or August 2023, run thousands of benchmarks in Node.

I think it's really cool because linters and more matters. And and the good side is Boschian.

that's awesome. Node. Js Node. Js is initialized. So if you run a console log Hello, world. On an project, it takes 150 milliseconds with with with this knowledge, Loders, winters are coming. But Node bottleneck in the scenario is that because they are run on Bos and they don't have any JavaScript context, But I think the most like, the most recent example that I can give you is that BRAFT has this option to optimize for space or optimize for speed.

Does I'm just quickly googling. Does that support

up until to your root directory. So if you are under slash users, yeah, against desktop Make sure, like,

with such a a small change. I I know that's been a kind of a theme throughout this conversation.

gray area that most people don't know or don't want to contribute is that

alloys. Interesting. Yeah. Yeah. Mine was definitely more of a, I'm exploring

120,000

I really like that. Oh, I never heard of this, it was Node function that was being called that was taking, like, 99%

Node project and NPM project is extremely different projects, to Dash.

like,

JSON five, which is not a standard, but it's the and then return the compiled Should I do it a different way? What would you do in that case? Would you go to, like, JS bench or JS perf or something like that and and write a test case and run it

Yeah.

having some like, 16 enable it as a module by using f five with Node change. Oh.

Flags added to it. And like you said, those that gets kind of unruly

Yeah. Man, if somebody can figure out how to

If you have a for loop and if you have a 100 elements, instead of going 1 by 1, if your instruction tasks are noncontroversial, get to you. What do you think about TypeScript

Better way of writing JSON

Yeah. Evan Yu, 200 rules on 590 files Finish in 50. That's true because, like, I'm starting to see sometimes in my in my editor,

JSON. Why do we need another

So so let me I just wanted to clarify that. Yeah. The other thing is that using a config file is extremely optional. We don't want, and then return the response of that to the.

I was trying to write a video encoding

and found,

there's a limit to what you can give to the arguments,

a JavaScript oxidation

worth it. Like, even if we write a rule in Rust, I'm okay with it.

I mean, those those are just massive vectors.

people are probably thinking, like, don't we already have A config file,

JS written by Boschian use triggering garbage collection a lot of times, and that becomes a v eight problem.

Yeah.

right? And you have like A dev command and you have a production command and maybe you'll have, like, another command that runs it in with a bunch of different

in your current directory benchmarks, Yeah. I get that. But, like, if if I look into the past, I think, this is what,

1 by 1, moving ESLint rules to OXC.

and,

I recommend following me.

exports, imports, and one more thing that I forgot. So, In a size that we can't comprehend. This means that because of the performance improvements, we have Happy path is towards, like, the positive outcome of this function.

because that's not the intention of it. I don't know the Backstory of how package, JSON become pack package, JSON, but for the sake of it, it support. But what you can do is that if you want to use a package, JSON, of course, you can just programming that we all accept as a On top of that, is JS a must.

I like what you like this. It's amazing.

Because that's that's where the real engineering comes in, and I want to be known for the engineering, not for the BS at that time. Yeah. Appreciate that. I know it sometimes brings the heat, but So we shouldn't it goes character by character, You try to find the most common,

single thread. Yeah. I was doing a,

the industry and, development in Node,

cut lines of code Because I included SIM JSON as a dependency

Node.

immediate

and super, super fast parse, The main reason for this change is that,

because of how the, Wes and CJS folders are implemented,

error. Yes. And I was like, no, I fixed that, and you have to hit save again. I don't know if that's in the saving or in the parsing of it, but

But,

then you can

which is the package.

It's amazing to have such a big impact

it's highly unlikely, and it's I I don't recommend it at all for Go from the streets. Awesome. And that SIMD is extremely useful because of All of these really big, but the actual call to call change was around maybe 1,000 lines or 800 lines, But it's extremely small, and you start to look into the flame graph less, She care about it's, it it puts Node JS in a really crucial and important Node. Js applications. They are unfortunately

retrieve the only the, the important ones. Mhmm. So yeah. The, with that PR, I think ESMA, CSS applications just got 5% faster.

Mhmm.

That can be rewritten in Rust Mhmm. Especially parsing all of the files and,

we just need this is a much more detailed application the detailed

for me in my project, get me to, You know, 60 FPS, what I was trying to hit. And it was just yeah. It was a it was a nuts experience to to actually see that that type of world in action. So, there is this particular

to look into instructions for, whatever language that you want.

comes in that you don't have to think about in any Node.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Wes had Nicholas Zakas, who's the author of ESLint on, and he's been he's like he's like, we can't ever rewrite the whole thing in Rust because,

takes 50 milliseconds. So Oh my gosh. 200 enabled rules. And it's like, how how is that possible? giving,

where you can bring us a sick pick, which is something that you're just you just like right Node, and a shameless plug, something you wanna bug, something you want people to check out. Okay. So for sick pigs, I can say that I'm, I I so I'm a huge fan of rust based,

config file? And I'll say real quick, The idea with the config file is that, like,

basically go for IO bound, Which is the limitation of the computer itself, and this is what's happening in here. Holy. So it's it's 3 times faster than a console log to ESLint your entire project.

while I was looking through

anything specific to that type of

Multithreading, which is something I've never had to think about as a web developer in my entire life. And, it was shocking to me how much how

and I don't think SIMD, JSON supports it as well. Okay. But SIMD JSON is the fastest JSON parser, I think, in the world right now.

So, hopefully, they will find a solution which is worth, pretty pretty major, PRs right out of the right out of the gate, so it's pretty incredible. The easiest thing That's an engineer could do is to replace or refactor or rewrite something. So that's what I'm basically doing is that replacing old tools with new tools so that we have the performance boost and maybe save some money while doing that. So Nice. Nice. Oh, that's awesome. Yeah. We're gonna talk about,

Including bio, but there's also a new kid in town, which is OXC

good. And what I really like about the project is that this is extremely good quote saying that JSON is a specification. JSON 5 isn't JS far as I know. No. It's not. And yeah. SIM JSON doesn't support it Because it goes for Right now, I think we have maybe 20, 30 different CI machines. We have only 1 benchmark CI. This is mostly because we Well, we are like Node. Js is an open source or organization,

on my personal website, which is the IPs Scott c o. You could just Node. Js license is included in, Node. Js modules team, including, so right now, we don't have we have a FFI, but it's an open PR.

So, I think on Rust, SIEMD is still experimental, But I personally, people use. And for video processing, Paying this price, Yeah. We trust applications. It's extremely optimized, so you don't need to do it any and if you're a good engineer, just like, So, yeah, it's an extremely opt well optimized

of the actual Cool thing. And the flame graph was very visual to show it, and I was like, man, like, I don't know if I would have ever been able to figure out okay. It's obviously this part. I can comment out the function call, But Yep. You gotta go deeper than that. So the the the question is,

flame grafts give gives us.

it's extremely hard for v eight to optimize those kinds of or slash, which is a starting point of, path name or a question mark, which is a starting point of query because of the, operating system limitations.

probably was not Intentionally trying to make it 80:80 milliseconds, but Scott happened by accident, and it wasn't caught.

what I basically do is that I basically try to write it as fast as I can, so for the for the case of rust, Even writing super Wes Bos is extremely hard because right now then And I resigned,

I I was posting on the GitHub, and bunch of people got the flame graphs Scott. And

Cloudflare Worker. They give you 50 milliseconds, and

that particular portion. But the question is not about benchmarking the whole thing. I benchmark the whole process.

For example, parsing a URL or getting,

So,

that it's like an integration test. In instead of calling that particular function, you call everything, and then you realize

what is the percentage of the time that I spend on this particular function? That's what, Proper reasoning for that particular change.

With using less memory as possible, But yeah. Wow. It's really, really awesome. Yeah. Well, by the way, that PI was

There's much that you can do. There's limited things that you can do in order to improve this function, and then you realize that you give up, give up, and That becomes an educated decision rather than Mhmm.

And,

for anyone to have. So I had some issues

I was using some library, and it it kept going over, like, kept going 80 80 milliseconds. And I I distilled it down to simply just Creating an object was creating 80 milliseconds.

or read file sync. I basically do it, You just need to And the question becomes For SSE 2,

Yeah. What it led me to all of those.

writing the best

should I use should I spread this thing into an array and then slice the items out of it, or

scenario, but

If if you know those kinds of things and if you also make the deliberate choice of doing it, I think that's okay. But As to to summarize, it's not always, like, a black and white, I'm I'm I'm I'm a sucker for performance tools, so I really like,

So this is Yeah. This is like a prisoner's dilemma, the world in a in a Up until but also continuing to parse the remaining values.

That's that's why I'm here.

Performance is a mindset. It's not something that I can turn on or or turn off Yeah. Even though that particular Node is called maybe 1 or 2 times in the lifespan of that whole project. Yeah. I basically People don't understand that and assume that, Node, Wes is a company and Scott just an organization, but it's not. Yeah. Yeah. So it's extremely lonely that I can say that. Yeah.

Would you care for security if you don't get hacked at all? No. You won't care about it, but but because You don't care about just yesterday, I was invited to the web platform tests organization, which is the organization that

Node that I could write for that particular portion. But in In order to answer that question, let me rephrase the quest rephrase the question for a different industry.

and also a chicken in the egg problem as well. Because

when should you care about security? their applications start a little bit faster Because of the change that you did on that particular Node, and that's that's what what If so,

if there's any difference between the the 2 of them. If you run if if you iterate and if you call the slice, this means that You copy the memory twice. So this is if you have a thousandth array, then you have another memory as well. So if you are doing this A lot of times then we are basically c plus plus. I basically If the application that you're running is not optimized for running fast, Then there's there's much that you can do with even with the fastest have an impact to 1,000,000,000 people because WhatsApp Wes, Discord, Microsoft Teams, they all use Node. Js, and Told

So and because v eight is a JIT, which corresponds to just in time compiler,

random people around around the globe.

dotenv about performance.

node

like, so well received by the community. It was one of those, like,

has been

And recently, I feel like Node has switched to saying, you know what? Maybe we should make the DX a little bit and bake a few thing in in like like .env. Has there been a shift in,

you implemented

lately

either approve or reject any changes.

that was,

into Node. Js, and what curl is because they find it on their device or they find A file on their computer somewhere being like, you hacked my computer.

support, and loop over it. And, Oh, I've got the query params, and then you realize, oh, there's Validate at 13 gigs a second. It's it's true. Like, you think you think about podcast,

Add some of these features that people are doing. Like,

at all for that? Yeah. Yeah. So A 100,000 times to see His answer to that is that he handles, like, lots of common use cases, And this is something that I saw on one of the your poll Wes is,

saying, you know what? Maybe we should do

Yes. Thank you. And it feels like Node

I feel like a long time ago, it was like, no. Like, this is part of the community, the tooling. You can install a package to do that type of thing.

all about Node. Js

Node. Js.

Yagiz

Performance,

all kinds of stuff.

Friday's supper club. We're gonna be talking to

just Node. Js in general. Like, you've been

Hit the ground running over there doing

Oh, I'm starving.

Yarn of maybe you can explain to us your involvement in Node. Js, but we know you've been

Wash those hands, pull up a chair, and secure that feed bag, because it's time to listen to Scott Tolinski and Wes Bos attempt to use human language to converse with and pick the brains of other developers. I thought there was gonna be food,

How's it going? What what's up? How are you doing? Good. Good. Yeah. Thank you for inviting me and hosting me today. It's it's good. I was just getting that we were throwing error.

Nizupli,

the founder of the Node. Js performance team, The author and maintainer of Fast Query String,

I think kind of like 2 main things today, and then we'll see where that goes.

And Yagiz has been doing a ton of really amazing things. He's, been a voting member of the Node. Js As technical steering committee, a voting member of the Open JS Foundation,

is the Sanity

so buckle up and grab that old handle because this ride is going to get wild.

PRs you're submitting. It seems like you,

Cross Project Council,

used to my new job at Sanity, so, mostly learning new stuff. How's everything with you? Yeah. Going great over here. And I've been seeing on Twitter your But, yeah, I mostly work on performance. And, file system operations trying to find the tech adjacent.

a 150 plus commits on Node. Js, and he's the reason why we have dotenv ESLint as well. Awesome. I I just wanted to have a quick question because I know you're you're you mentioned that you

I sure hope you're hungry.

So welcome to the show.

1st, I want to talk about, like, performance and how you figure out How things are slow and how you figure out how to make things faster,

we're a founding member of Perf team, and you're pretty heavily involved as well as we have some pretty exciting announcements of stuff coming to know that you're gonna You're gonna leak to the audience. Right?

This

basically, because it's an async, you can do that whenever you require Rust function. It might Compile it. If it's not compiled,

loaders that I think I'm not sure if it's being written or not, but I just found out that CSS modules. I didn't even realize that CSS modules is

Or not a loader, a Rust file. Yeah.

Make things like supporting TypeScript maybe a bit easier than

Rust

And we can basically So yeah.

like, the limit is yourself. Like, you can't completely do anything, and that's what Frightens me the most and also makes me excited me the most. Yeah.

FFI

regarding this, improving the error path of Node FS modules. So we were previously calling, I can easily say that OXC. So Bosch and is also, Those kinds of small things, released a library called Ada, which is named after my daughters.

Yeah. Do you know just just, You know, trying to get my my hands dirty a little bit in the Rust world, so I I wrote, like, a a script that is checking to make sure We have the right thing set up, the right E and V variables,

the contents of the file. We pass it to a hook, And you can,

a ECMA spec.

you can basically call that, compile it, and make it an executable pnpm execute that function or Through child process or whatever, you don't even need to call FFI Right now, I know the

Oh, yeah. That's pretty cool. But you have to, like, you have to compile that and ship that with the the repo. Right? Because it's Correct. It's native. So this this

And the way that you can import

You can dynamically compile the TypeScript file into a JavaScript and then return JavaScript from that file without updating I mostly, having much more impact than the flame breath that I'm currently looking at. This means that I want I like to look at to the quote that no one parameter, Would you care for security if you get hacked? Yes.

you know, duplicating from an example if, the example has been updated, but the personal

So this so you can basically run or But,

from that. Yes.

Low maybe you can describe what loaders are because I think it's sort of an unknown feature of Node. JS, and it can

e n v. Basically, just trying to get somebody onboarded into the site, seeding the database Bos those types of thing. Yeah. Nice.

if it's Child's process, it could execute it and return the STD out So yeah. So whenever it when so I can give you a quick example. If you have h t p s google.com, You change how you write your code and you try to optimize it. So it's not about iterating or calling map or filter multiple times. It's about I try to add new features, And as a result of that, we have these drastic changes because,

and enable,

dynamically by a third party application, last year, December, a year ago, I founded Node,

by the output of the loader, and then you would just get the response then. You executed pnpm.

it can create a child process or a worker thread, execute that.

And And you think, Node. Js is people are gonna groan when they hear us, but stay with us because I think it's actually really necessary. Node. Js is getting a config file. Is that what you're working on right now? Yes. Right now, I am working on a Config file, which basically is a JSON file that you can,

Wes, And these changes are done by the,

or building it. This is extremely beneficial because this means that the contents doesn't matter.

opinion of Node core collaborators have changed, and that's why we're seeing those kind of Deno featured right now.

So that's a Chromium what is the most impactful.

we have, part of,

and ease of Implementing implementing attracted more c plus plus developers in the past couple of months.

Yeah. I think the the other, general

And on top of that, it it basically is a state machine, but they're really glorified and extremely unperformed

All of that. And I initially, I was like, well, like, isn't that part of that's not part of VA. That's a a browser API, right, that's been implemented in node? Yes.

or easily noticeable by engineers. It Scott that much attention. The URL parser is the, like, new URL, and then you get the everything, the port, the path name, the the search brands,

as as and the impact the default value of encoding is UTF-eight.

because Wes if you run a node index dot Wes s and it doesn't even have any files in it, it actually o o two n or or or or what's the is it growing exponentially or so on and so forth? So the question is, unless it's extremely specific thing or you have a really big project, but you have no idea what's what's going on, then Mhmm. You dive into the flame there. We talked to Jared Sumner from BUN,

explanation of the whole situation. What kind of, like, sick person writes 20,000 lines of c and euro?

So is everywhere, and we just don't know it because there isn't anybody like me that tells you that.

we basically implemented it With the help of Daniel Lemery, for personal not not not important, but not crucial APIs are written in JavaScript.

creates new URL 5 times.

What could it possibly be doing in in all of those lines?

So it's not as simple

a professor from Canada, architecture and fastest computer.

Like, what what what is it doing? Yeah. You're now so there's a group called Watweegee, For example, when you call an FS feed file sync, you don't assume that it will throw an error. So one of the, like, the manuals.

I tend to think towards saying that, like, okay. If I call this function, it will make 2 c plus plus calls. But if I do this 1, it will make 1. And depending on usage, this might be faster or not. And then the question becomes much more clear, and maintains the tests across all browsers.

2, 3 months ago Unicorn. Yes. Then config Unicorn.

And on top of that, around, change.

performance stuff. Awesome. And let's talk about that real quickly. It's like

the Node. Js performance team with the focus of improving Node. Js performance and the crucial parts.

but I mostly work on, like, And you know that most people call the read file sync, and I I I recently Use, or collaborators are, are a product of this move.

initiative champion,

if I had some time and if the We realized that we could improve the error, the faulty path of these functions by 100 or like 150%, is Dare to look into that Node, and they will accept that be because it's working, it's okay. So this is how I,

Yep.